tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461685803058764193.post9133326824975067003..comments2019-08-01T19:52:50.283-07:00Comments on Common Saints: Reaching vs PreachingDan McGowanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09523180205289209777noreply@blogger.comBlogger7125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461685803058764193.post-58687224943965873442009-03-28T19:49:00.000-07:002009-03-28T19:49:00.000-07:00Hi Phil - nice to meet you! (I figured "Hal" was y...Hi Phil - nice to meet you! (I figured "Hal" was you secret "2001" identity...)<BR/><BR/>The whole concept of "church shopping" wherein we go out looking for a place that fits "our needs" is quickly becoming very repulsive to me. After 40 years of "being in church" I can honestly say that I have experienced only a handful of moments - snapshots - where I truly felt that God, through His Son, Jesus, and in the Power of The Holy Spirit, was honestly, truly MOVING in our midst as a congregation. I happen to believe that most churches fall more into the "me, me, me!" club - - and when we don't LIKE "X" - we decide to (as a pastor buddy of mine says) "take our marbles and go home." That's just the way it is.<BR/><BR/>When I was living in Southern California, my wife and I found a place that we felt was focused far more on the PERSON of Christ, and far less on the PROGRAM stuff. <BR/><BR/>Here, in Denver, we have found a place that even surpasses that church we had discovered in SoCal. It seems to be a genuinely "Spirit Led" and "Spirit Focused" group of people where nobody concerns themself with music styles or the clock or attire - or any of the other trappings that bring to much grief to the body of Christ . The Spirit MOVES - and the pastor ALLOWS for this - and everyone WAITS on the Lord - times of worship (singing, prayer, dancing, etc) can last 15 minutes or 60 minutes - and it's OK! LOL...<BR/><BR/>That is what I crave because I have found that, for me, my spiritual relationship is nourished in such a setting. <BR/><BR/>My "other church" (or ministry opportunity) comes simply by BEING a follower of Jesus out in the real world - meeting and interacting with people who need friends, love, acceptance, support, encouragement, etc. <BR/><BR/>Ya know - kinda like that stuff Jesus did...Dan McGowanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09523180205289209777noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461685803058764193.post-80006679696236664172009-03-24T07:04:00.000-07:002009-03-24T07:04:00.000-07:00Yeah...I'm not sure why I keeps calling me Hal on ...Yeah...I'm not sure why I keeps calling me Hal on here...something must have happened with the set up. Anywho, my real name is Phil, but most people use my internet handle, JCServant.<BR/><BR/>I wholeheartedly agree with your sentiments. I continue to look into the 'organic church' setup that these various sites and books by Frank Viola. On one hand, I feel that it certainly addresses a number of issues and obstacles found in the traditional church. On the other hand, it can be hard just to find a handful of like minded believers who are willing to do something like that, especially in Salt Lake City! <BR/><BR/>With that being said, I'm becoming more and more convinced that not everyone is called to be in a church at every point in their life. And, I agree with you that really, the primary focus of our life has got to be on following God, and seeking His Will. If we put Him first in all things in our life, then, if it His Will, He will lead us to the appropriate people or grouping where we know we can serve Him.<BR/><BR/>Until then, my wife and I will continue to serve Him outside of any grouping or organization (aside from Cyberlight Comics, where I post comics and maintain the site). Let us live our lives for Him!Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12024027571693533059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461685803058764193.post-13890288998835265352009-03-23T21:29:00.000-07:002009-03-23T21:29:00.000-07:00Hal - I appreciate your comments and it sounds lik...Hal - I appreciate your comments and it sounds like the Lord has been busy reshaping you for your unique ministry/calling in life. That is very exciting.<BR/><BR/>I think, for me, the issue of "church" is more of a case-by-case basis. I don't think the concept of people gathering for worship is wrong, per se. It all depends on the purpose for that gathering. Far too often, these gatherings that we call "church" tend to be "man-driven" vs. "Holy-Spirit-led" and that is when we get into trouble. We humans are creatures of habit and we want things to go OUR way - or we get upset. <BR/><BR/>I think choosing to live a life that truly follows Christ and seeks to trust Him for all - well - that is not easy. It's not easy because it takes an enormous amount of faith and courage. But it is also not easy because it runs so contrary to our culture - not just the secular culture, but the Christian culture, too. <BR/><BR/>Thanks for sharing your heart in your thoughts! Means a lot to me.Dan McGowanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09523180205289209777noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461685803058764193.post-29640153710662472442009-03-18T07:32:00.000-07:002009-03-18T07:32:00.000-07:00I totally agree. But, maybe the reason it's not ea...I totally agree. But, maybe the reason it's not easy is because the church, as we know it now, is nothing like what God wanted for us. <BR/><BR/>I've been a Christina for 15 or so years. As a Christian comic creator, and site administrator, some could argue that I am living my life as God intended. After all, for six years, my friends and I have constantly produced comics that lead people closer to God.<BR/><BR/>Yet, every time I would go to a church, I knew something was wrong. I just couldn't put my finger on it. As you allude to, it was just hard to accomplish anything significant for God inside a church. I felt like I stopped growing (And when organisms stop growing, they tend to die). The church might be great for receiving instruction, especially for those new to the faith, but it seems like a terrible place to actually contribute and serve, despite the fact the Jesus teaches us we should be servants.<BR/><BR/>I have not read "ReImagining Church" myself either. However, I have read a bit of "AllAtHisFeet.com" and listened to a lot of their podcasts. While I have not bought into, or always agree with, everything they say, once you understand how the early church ran, and how get some idea of how the 'organic expression of Jesus' body' might run today, you realize 1) just how far away from that the traditional church is and 2) get a much clearer vision of where to go. With that, I now have a much better idea what "Church" really is, the important role it plays in my continued growth even at this stage in my walk, and how I might be able to actually serve others in that setting, as Christ instructs.<BR/><BR/>I understand your sentiment to want to live the Christian life, and not spend so much time reading different ideologies. Sometimes, we waste a lot of time reading and talking theology instead of just living the life of Love Jesus teaches. I would suggest, however, that as long as you try to grow and serve in a traditional church, you will continue to spin some wheels in the mud. Before you can drive someplace, you have to spend a little time reading the map or you might end up taking a very long way around. If you take the time to check some of this stuff out, as I did, it might galvanize you, as it did me. For the first time in about 10 years, I feel like I have a clear idea of what I need to do next to grow, and some future opportunities for me to serve my brothers in Christ. -JCSAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12024027571693533059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461685803058764193.post-16593946315179851962009-03-17T17:23:00.000-07:002009-03-17T17:23:00.000-07:00I have read Pagan Christianity but not the others....I have read Pagan Christianity but not the others... I think I'm just ready to REALLY try and LIVE what Jesus taught us - as opposed to reading about, or singing about what Jesus taught us... and, unfortunately, in the church, it ain't all that easy...Dan McGowanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09523180205289209777noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461685803058764193.post-62307355612376352882009-03-17T09:50:00.000-07:002009-03-17T09:50:00.000-07:00BTW... you can email me at wildlight at hotmail do...BTW... you can email me at wildlight at hotmail dot com - JCSAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12024027571693533059noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1461685803058764193.post-45458248797040451682009-03-16T06:51:00.000-07:002009-03-16T06:51:00.000-07:00I was wondering... Have you read the book, "Pagan ...I was wondering... Have you read the book, "Pagan Christianity?" and/or "Reimagining Church."? Or, perhaps you have read the site "AllAtHisFeet.com" All of these talk about serious concerns in our modern church set up that are not just incondusive to reaching people for Christ, but actually do a number of things that go against Jesus' teachings. I just started studying it, and wrote the first entry of my journal at http://cyberlightcomics.com/bboard2/index.php?topic=359.0 detailing the challenge with the position of pastor. What do you think? -JCSAnonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12024027571693533059noreply@blogger.com